The Arc

topic posted Thu, October 27, 2005 - 4:30 PM by  → Mark
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Have you ever noticed that when someone tells you an interesting story it always tends to be a moment of paradigm shift?

It seems people have these moments that change their lives - and sometimes a series of them.

It is strange then how much emphasis is put on the concept of "character arc." If you've ever sat in a meeting with producers or investors, you've most certainly heard the "character arc" concept bandied about almost as much as names of famous people.

But I believe this term "character arc" is quite misleading - it helps promote the concept that leads to a really bad and incredibly common young writer mistake of making things happen again and again (usually 3 times) in order to establish that this is the person's life. "His boss pushes him around - then his son pushes him around - then his dog forces him out of the chair." In reality - a perfect scene with the boss would have established this and no more scenes would be necessary. That was slightly tangential, but put there to emphasize the problem that "arc'ing" leads to a subtraction of drama by spreading the change out over many scenes.

I'm not trying to make rules about writing, but I am putting forth this idea:

Drama happens in the moment - if you can charge you scene to a dramatic moment of change - you will have a lot more mileage out of that than creating that change over time as an "arc" implies.

I am sure many brilliant writers are using arc's - but I betcha they don't think about them the way I hear them talked about 95% of the time. They probably think of them as key paradigm shifts, yet call them arcs to fit in.

Thoughts?
posted by:
→ Mark
Los Angeles
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  • Re: The Arc

    Thu, October 27, 2005 - 8:35 PM
    True, in real life all we need to see if the guy getting pushed around by his boss, but I don't think its such a bad thing when its reinforced in several scenes. That's the beauty of cinema - they can exaggerate and dramatize reality.

    Maybe I'm not following your point, but since when are reoccuring themes a bad thing?
    • Re: The Arc

      Fri, October 28, 2005 - 1:41 AM
      Fair question eventhough this is about character reinforcement more than the arc, but let's address it.

      What do you gain from reinforcing an idea - when you are simply reinforcing an idea?

      Would a scene be more powerful if each scene had it's own purpose rather than a reiteration of an idea? If you must reiterate an idea - does this not mean that the original iteration was not strong enough?
      • Re: The Arc

        Sun, October 30, 2005 - 2:00 PM
        Even Shakespeare's work consisted of reiterations of ideas.

        But, I agree, it's possible to need only one scene to state an idea. Depending on how well it was implemented, thats all the audience needs. But there are times when the audience wants to see reinforcement of this idea/theme for entertainment value.
        • Re: The Arc

          Sun, October 30, 2005 - 2:41 PM
          "Even Shakespears's work consisted of reiterations of ideas."

          Can you site an example?

          "entertainment value" - There are many theories on repetition in comedy. A comedian once told me that anything is funny if you repeat it enough. If he ever told a joke that failed - the rest of the show he would somehow work the punchline into his other jokes and by the end of the show he'd turned the failure into something that worked simply by repeating.

          But that's more like a motif. I'm mostly talking about scenes which exist for the reason of making this point.
          • Re: The Arc

            Sun, October 30, 2005 - 3:56 PM
            I can't site an example off the top of my head, but I remember from my shakespeare classes that we listed all the repeated themes, metaphors, play with words, and plotlines.
            • Repeating

              Sun, October 30, 2005 - 5:22 PM
              Those are all motif's though - so maybe I was too ambigious in my original comment because I was commenting on something else mainly... My point though about repeition better stated is this.


              There is an inclination in writing that in order to establish an aspect of your character - it is necessary to create a series of beats which demonstrate this aspect in a variety of ways. In actuality - it's not necessary. We judge characters very quickly and since we spend so little time with them, we assume any choice they make defines who they are. In fact, if they make a choice which is contradictory to this, that needs an explanation at some point.

              The key point is that if you're a reader or working in development - you become very aware when someone is doing something for the sake of the story or when you are being "demonstrated" something. You can tell when the author is writing a scene that says "see? He's shy. Okay, let me show you again. Shyyyyy. Okay - one more time, see? Shyyyyyyyy."

              This will come out of his character through his choices while navigating through the movie - but in ESTABLISHING a character, it is not necessary - the readers will judge him that way the very first time they see it.
              • Re: Repeating

                Mon, October 31, 2005 - 12:08 AM
                I don't believe "arc" implies redundant repetition, it implies a curve, a heightening, finalizing in a new destination. In the case of a character arc, something builds from a certain point, then resolves, ending up somewhere new.

                From what I can remember, in Shakespear's THE TEMPEST - Variations on Prospero's desire for revenge play in aspect in almost every scene, then by the end he's past the need for revenge and has taken an interest in reconciliation.

                Or a more contemporary example... In ALIENS, for instance, one could make a case that Ripley has an arc the revolves around the issue of "responsibility". These issues are addressed not just once, but throughout in every act. They are addressed not monotonously but with vacillation: Ripley has taken great responsibility in the past and has gotten burned. Now she shuns it and is alone, without purpose, cut off from everyone. She is a shell of a person. She refuses responsibility through much of the first act. Then after several scenes, accepts it in a limited form. Throughout the film, the level of responsibly that is demanded of her, and that she is willing to embrace is increased, until she practically adopts Newt as her own daughter, and takes full responsibly for Newt's life, putting her own (and everyone else's) in jeopardy to save her. At the end of the movie her awesome embracing of responsibility is rewarded. She saves Newt and now has something like a family. We know she has changed, she will never walk away from her responsibly to look after Newt. She's better now, despite the horror of her experiences.

                I was trying to think about really good movies about shy people. "Who Am I This Time?" is a great example. Until after the climax of the film, Christopher Walken is shown as painfully shy every time he's off stage.
                • Re: Repeating

                  Mon, October 31, 2005 - 10:01 AM
                  "I don't believe "arc" implies redundant repetition, it implies a curve,"

                  Damn, I was afraid this was going to happen. I should have started a new thread when that idea came up. If you read through all the posts, you will see that the discussion of the repeating began as an aside and has nothing to do with the discussion of the arc which the thread was initially about.

                  But to clarify - my comments about "the arc" and my comments about techniques of establishing a character (repeating) are completely unrelated.
                  • This is the maximum depth. Additional responses will not be threaded.

                    Re: Repeating

                    Mon, October 31, 2005 - 1:01 PM
                    Oops...it's my fault, I set us off-topic. Both discussions are entertaining, anyhow.

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